Vodou and Urantia, what are the connections?

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Vodou and Urantia, what are the connections?

Post by admin » Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:41 pm

Two years ago, Gifrants challenged us with a series of questions about Vodou. Here are some of them:
What is Voodoo?
How do I learn about Voodoo?
Does Voodoo tell me who I am?
What does Voodoo teach about God?
Who is a Ginen?
Where is Ginen?
Who is a "Bonzanj"
About praying? Whom do I pray?
Who are those Gods?
Do they have a gender?
Who is a male? Who is a female?
Why do they have a gender?
Can people be "possessed"
How does it happen?
Why does it happen?
Can this God, in the mind of his or her servant, be everywhere or somewhere else at the same time?
Do those gods eat?
Why do they expect to give them a "manjay"?
Why do they want me to keep a black bottle somewhere?
What is the meaning of those symbols, if they are symbols?
Is it possible to marry those Gods or Goddesses?
Can there be same sex marriages?
Why should I marry them?
How do we consummate this marriage?
Am I going to sleep with them?
Why, if I marry one of them, or many of them, can I still have a human wife?
Tell me about the nights when I"m supposed to be alone in my bed, even though I"m married to my wife?
Why do we call upon them instead of God?
Why are they the focus of those ceremonies?
Why do we call them "Papa" or "Manman" if they did not create us?
Did they create us?
If they did not create us, who created them?
What did they create?
What do they know about time?
Do they control space?
What is space?
What is universe?
Do they control the universe?
Who else is there?
Where do those Gods go?
Can they fly out of this planet?
What is their purpose in life?
About the white people, who the hell are they?
Can they be possessed?
Why do they live, and explore their potential more than we do?
What a hell those Ginen, and lwa are going to do about it?
We are killing each other in Haiti? What can they do nothing about it?
We are being humiliated around the world, what do they do nothing about it?
DO I have or need to praise them, to pray them, celebrate their divinity, their power in order to get their attention?
How many are they?
Who is the leader?
Who is more powerful?
Gede? Ti Jan? What one can say about the indecent language, totally inappropriate for children, of Gede and Ti Jan during their divine manifestations?
What are they going to write about Voodoo? What are we going to read about Voodoo? What do those gods tell us about themselves?
What do they want from us?
Can they dispose of us the way they want or please?
Where is this going to take us? Why do we have to do this?
Do neighbors have the right to sleep quietly in the middle of the night?
How many times a week those voodoo ceremonies will be allowed? Is it all day? Is it all night?
Holidays to celebrate the gods and goddesses? National holidays?
What are the implications of such a decision?
What do Haitians really know about Voodoo?
Who knows what?
Who is going to teach whom?
Who is going to teach what?
Some forum participants have provided answers to some of those questions. I cannot vouch for any of them, because I am truly an ignorant person in this field. You may find some answers to some of the questions here: However, the questions that have intrigued me the most are Gifrants' last two:

1) Who is going to teach whom?

2) Who is going to teach what?

Gifrants previously answered my queries with this response:
Guy,

I have been always afraid to teach. I've been playing the guitar for more than 30 years. Every time, I've been approached by someone, my answer has always been the same.

If someone wants to learn from me, it will be only for a short term, and that person needs to show me really he or she wants to learn.

The Urantia book will be our bible on this planet. I've been guided slowly to understand what most people would not. It's not because they cannot learn, it's because they have made their choice to do whatever they want with their lives.

I do not have the credentials to teach anyone about Vodou. I do not intend to teach anyone about Vodou. That has been always the major problem of anybody who knows what most people do not know. Imagine how many people died and are still dying today because they think differently.

When Jesus said that his kingdom was in the Heavens, the rabbis laughed at him. They knew his father and his mother. When he said that he was the Son of God, some rabbis tore their toga. They called his words blasphemy. One of them even said that he knew the laws of God. If God wanted to send the Messiah, the Messiah would be born among his children.

I'm not in the business of convincing anyone. I'm going to give you a few examples that may relate the Midwayers to the Lwa we are referring in Vodou. The last one is personal. But, I will tell you anyway.
  • 3 Fey 3 Rasin o
    Jete blye, ranmase sonje
    3 Fey 3 Rasin o
    Jete blye, ranmanse sonje
    Mwen gen yon basen dlo
    3 Fey tonbe ladan
    Jete blye, ranmase sonje

    3 Fey--God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Spirit. The ones who disagree, have rejected them and forgotten. The ones who believe, have not forgotten I'm alive--Water is the symbol of life and purification.

    Those 3 Gods are part of my life. The ones you disagree, have rejected them and forgotten. The ones who believe, have not forgotten.

    Sa se langaj daki. Who do you think wrote this song? And why? and when?

    This song has been written by people who have lived a major struggle. Our lwa, Ginen and Lesen because they sing this song have lived it.
  • 21 degre. What does that mean in Vodou? Yon moun sevi 21 Lesen.

    Se langaj daki. The lwa are trying to convey mysteries to us. 21 is exactly the number of Ancient of Days throughout the 7 superuniverses--3 for each superuniverse and they are the first to be listed on the records of the Central Isle of Paradise. Anything one does not know is a mystery. Once you know, it's no longer a mystery.
  • Zan ki zan poze. Once in a year, the Midwayers gather outside of this planet, at the Pole North, to replete their energy. The Satania energy circuit has been made available for them to sustain their immortality.
  • I was about 7 years old, when I heard Ogou Balendjo saying to my grandmother-- Mwen se ofelen, manman m mouri, papan m mouri. Both Adamson and his wife died. However the children who became the Primary Midwayers, and the Secondary Midwayers are still alive. The Primary Midwayers are working with the legion of Archangels who are on this planet. The only planet who is benefiting of their presence because Jesus said he would be back. The Secondary Midwayers are working with us, being the link between any superior beings and us--for translation and to facilitate understanding.
Like most of us, who are still looking for the way, the light and life, I'm being guided.

As I said, I'm not in the business here to convince anyone. To those who believe so much in Vodou, all they have to do is ASK. Why don't ask Ti Jan, Papa Pye, Erzili Freda, Erzili Danto, Ogou Feray, Ogou Baguidy, Marasa, Gede Nibo, why don't you ask who the hell they are? I did, why don't you?

I told you I was baptized by one of them. I told you that I'm a Ginen. Do you think I'm lying to you? Did you ever think about who they are? How do they live? Now, if they do not tell you, they do not even pay attention to your questions, would you say I'm still lying, or maybe, you are not really serious about your faith?

Spiritualism has nothing to do with intellectualism. I'm not going to say he following because I want to judge anyone spiritually. Go to your archives, and look, for I did ask:

Where are the vodou believers? Where are the masons?
Where are the Rose Cross? Where are the Martinists?
Where are those intellectuals bragging about their books and their degree in our mess in Haiti?
Who was Aristide? He was a priest. Imagine how many times he drank on the altar the blood of Jesus? for what? To do what he is doing now?

Most Haitian brag about being part of a spiritual sect. I heard their comments. They are very snob about their siyo, reset, senbol. Anfen, anfen, se pa ni yonn ni de. Saki mason, rozikrizyen e matinis, e vodouizan a lafwa. Sak gen la?

How are you going to disagree because you do not understand? No one can really understand God? Why then they believe?

For us who are still looking, faith has helped understand. A man with no faith is a blind man.

Let me tell you this again. if it were not for the Ginen, I would have never known what I know now. You have no idea how far I've gone. It is not only about an adventure, Guy. It is all about God, Faith, and Eternity.

Next time, you meet Ti Jan in a Vodou ceremony. Tell him I say Hi. Nou piti men nou la. Nou bite, men nou pa tonbe. Van gwonde pi mal pase siklonn, men chandel la pa tenyen. Si li pa reponn w, ajoute tou senpleman--komision pa chaj.

Ginen yo se Midwayers yo. Se kontak direk yo ye. Se pa pou granmesi tout namchon, espesyalman Blan yo ak siveye Ayiti konsa, e kenbe Ayisyen anba yon eto sovaj. Eseye panse selman ki kote Ayiti ak Ayisyen ka ye si yo te louvri non selman ke yo men lespri yo tou?
One key sentence in Gifrants's answer was this:
The Urantia book will be our bible on this planet.
That may be where we should start in order for us to understand Gifrants's teachings more intelligently. In particular, I wonder if Gifrants would mind explaining the process by which he came to establish the connections between Urantia and Vodou, if that is not too much to ask.

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Post by admin » Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:50 pm

When Gifrants mentions these words, they may sound new to a lot of you:
  • Edentia
  • Havona
  • Urantia
  • Caligastia
  • Satania
in addition to
  • The Primary Midwayers
  • The Secondary Midwayers
  • Adam and Eve and their first son, Adamson,
Here are some links that you can go to, in order to gather some additional knowledge about those concepts:
  • TheoQuest
  • The Urantia Book Online
  • The Urantia Book
  • http://www.TruthBook.com : Discover Jesus and the Urantia Book[/*:m]
and what looks like a related but very odd, very political, and very opinionated site:
Planetary Headquarters, Home to Caligastia, which contains some rather incredible articles of side interest such as "A Message To Black America".

Gelin_

Post by Gelin_ » Tue Nov 08, 2005 10:14 am

A lot of this is really new to me. Thank you, Guy. - gelin

Gelin_

Post by Gelin_ » Wed Nov 30, 2005 10:31 am

Reading about the Origin and Source of the Urantia Book, I find these words very interesting:
The Urantia Book was written in 1934-1935 and published in 1955. The book proclaims to be authored by numerous supermortal (angel-like) beings as a Revelation to our world. It is the first Epochal Revelation since Jesus and the fifth since the beginning of human life on Earth. No humans are associated with authoring The Urantia Book and the technique whereby the papers were transcribed is unknown...
gelin

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Post by admin » Wed Nov 30, 2005 11:45 am

Very interesting, indeed! I particularly like the last sentence of the quote.

I know that you probably got it from one of the sources I cited above, but which one in particular?

Gelin_

Post by Gelin_ » Wed Nov 30, 2005 12:36 pm

I went digging in http://www.truthbook.com/ and found that interesting statement. I keep looking for authors, like name, credentials....but nothing yet.

gelin

Moyse

Post by Moyse » Mon Nov 09, 2009 9:43 am

What is Voodoo?

Vodou se Natur li ye.

How do I learn about Voodoo?

Ou pa aprann Vodou a, Vodou a la deja le ou fèt fèt. Ou aprann sèlman Kilti Vodou-a ( ki fèt nan sosyete yo) avèk relijyon Vodou-a (sa nou rele Kan).


What does Voodoo teach about God?

Bondye gen anpil fason pou montre pouvwa li.

About praying? Whom do I pray?

Lapriye ak Seremoni yo se pou bondye, Lwa yo se mesaje yo ye. Tout seremoni yo se pou bondye sèlman.

Can people be "possessed"

Wi, ou ka gen direk kontak


Can this God, in the mind of his or her servant, be everywhere or somewhere else at the same time?

Sènbol bondye se an koulev men li pa an koulèv....li tout kote.


Is it possible to marry those Gods or Goddesses?
Can there be same sex marriages?
Why should I marry them?
How do we consummate this marriage?
Am I going to sleep with them?
Why, if I marry one of them, or many of them, can I still have a human wife?
Tell me about the nights when I"m supposed to be alone in my bed, even though I"m married to my wife?



Tout sa avèk inisyasyon yo se an kontra ak bondye. Moun kontinye renouvle kontra sa.


Why do we call upon them instead of God?

Nou rele bondye...Lwa yo se mesaje yo ye.


Why are they the focus of those ceremonies?

Se bondye ki sèvi nan seremoni yo.


Did they create us?

Non.


We are killing each other in Haiti? What can they do nothing about it?
We are being humiliated around the world, what do they do nothing about it?

Bondye pa neglije nou anyen, Chak Fanmi Lwa yo gen misyon pou ede.


How many are they?

Nou ayisyen gen 401 non pou Bondye (menm jan Muslim yo gen 99 nom pou Allah)...men gen plis nou pakab konte.


Gede? Ti Jan? What one can say about the indecent language, totally inappropriate for children, of Gede and Ti Jan during their divine manifestations?

Gen Lwa ki se la pawol....Bondye pa neglije nou anyen.


Do neighbors have the right to sleep quietly in the middle of the night?


Lol! Wi, men Lanuit pa pou yo...Lol!


What do Haitians really know about Voodoo?

Anpil Ayisyen pa konnen li vreman paske anpil ayisyen te ACHTE li.


Who knows what?
Who is going to teach whom?
Who is going to teach what?

Fanmi ou se premye plas pou konpran li vreman.

Gelin_

Post by Gelin_ » Mon Nov 09, 2009 8:29 pm



About praying? Whom do I pray?

Lapriye ak Seremoni yo se pou bondye, Lwa yo se mesaje yo ye. Tout seremoni yo se pou bondye sèlman.


Why do we call upon them instead of God?

Nou rele bondye...Lwa yo se mesaje yo ye.


Why are they the focus of those ceremonies?

Se bondye ki sèvi nan seremoni yo.
M pa kwè repons sa yo bon. Yo bèl men sa pa vre!

gelin

Moyse

Post by Moyse » Tue Nov 10, 2009 7:03 am


M pa kwè repons sa yo bon. Yo bèl men sa pa vre!

gelin

M pa la pou batay ak kèk moun, Men, m konnen tout seremoni yo se pou Bondye.

Sonje nou te tonbe......Lwa yo se sèl bagay nou ka itilize, nou nan men bondye. Sonje tou...sa moun yo wè nan perestil yo pa menm bagay moun fè lakay yo, nan fanmi yo.

Gen diferans

Bouli

Post by Bouli » Wed Nov 11, 2009 11:35 am

Moyse,

Konpliman. Ou fE you bEl travay. Ou reponn tout kesyon sa yo poukont ou. Eske ou se you vodouizan de nesans, oubyen ou reklame nanm ou de you lOt relijyon...oubyen ou se you espE nan kilti an? Oukonnen ap toujou gen plis kesyon k'ap tann ou pi devan.

Repons mwen pi renmen an se "...lanwit pa pou yo..." Vodouizan yo te pran'l depi epok kolon jouk yo rive sezi tout zilan.

Moyse

Post by Moyse » Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:10 pm

Moyse,

Konpliman. Ou fE you bEl travay. Ou reponn tout kesyon sa yo poukont ou. Eske ou se you vodouizan de nesans, oubyen ou reklame nanm ou de you lOt relijyon...oubyen ou se you espE nan kilti an? Oukonnen ap toujou gen plis kesyon k'ap tann ou pi devan.

Le'm tande tanbou a m ablije danse....M kwe nan Bondye....M kwe nan mond envizib la (sa nou rele Djo)

Ki pèmèt mwen di se Vodouizan m ye, Men m pa inisiye.

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