Video interview with Dr. Paul Farmer

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Guysanto
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Video interview with Dr. Paul Farmer

Post by Guysanto » Tue May 06, 2008 8:45 pm


jafrikayiti
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Post by jafrikayiti » Tue May 06, 2008 10:38 pm

Simply beautiful !

Now, let the work of these medical doctors at Zanmi Lasante be an inspiration to me, to you and a million others. We can indeed make "miracles" happen in this life.

Thanks for sharing this Guy!

Jaf

Dr Roger Malebranche

Post by Dr Roger Malebranche » Wed May 07, 2008 8:58 am

I would gratefully accept anything good being done for my country and Dr Farmer is a loving and needed physician. Having lived and cared for poor Haitians and Haitian peasantry during a 2 years stint on the Southern coast I know from experience how deserving my countrymen are and how much they lack medical care. Dr Farmer deserves the sainthood.

That said, I will add that there are caring and competent Haitian physicians who would do the same if given a chance and the opportunity. But I doubt they would receive the kudos and recognition that Dr Farmer and Zanmi Lasante are getting. Perhaps it is a result from years of looking at the white man as the ultimate but there is and there always has been in Haiti an undercurrent thinking that somewhat the white physician was better. I remember the lines of Haitian patients going to Dr Waag, Dr Lemke etc... in the 40s and 50s. These physicians were German Jewish escapees from Nazi Germany. Haitians over the years have looked at white physicians as somewhat better and more knowledgeable than Black ones.

But it is not only the black Haitian. The black American behaves the same way. I remember black American patients refusing my care, preferring instead to go to white surgeons ( and I was the chief of the department, the one other physicians and their families came to ).

Our black insecurities should not take anything away from the Dr Farmer,
Dr Schweitzer, Mother Theresa etc... of the world. That is not the point of my entry. Indeed we need more and many more of these caring, loving human beings. But at the same time I would like Blacks to offer encouragement to their own home grown physicians to emulate white counterparts. Unfortunately often when they do they are met with suspicion, jealousy from the locals, ridicule. Worse, at times they are kidnapped, killed, held for ransom.

We still have a lot of work to do to reach a colorblind world. I am not bitter. I wanted to bring historical perpective to a Black behavior which has been going on for centuries. But as all of you know a prophet never gets recognition in his village. I SHALL keep trying.

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Post by Guysanto » Wed May 07, 2008 10:37 am

Words of wisdom. I don't have the time right now to fully respond, but I just want to say that your observations ring true. And this is not to take anything away from Paul Farmer, whom I personally know and admire. I have visited his Center in Cange, Haiti and I have written in an older forum about that experience which was truly a spiritual one. Dr. Paul Farmer is a hero in my book. But there are many Haitian doctors (and other leaders in every field) who deserve just recognition and are not getting it.

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Post by Guysanto » Wed May 07, 2008 11:22 am

In fact, when I visited Paul in Cange, he complained of the fact that there was always a very long line of desperate Haitian patients waiting to be seen by him [some of their deformities were incredible!], when the waiting lines for highly competent Haitian associates were much shorter or inexistent. The staff would prod our countrymen to go to the other doctors who could treat them as well, but they needed to respect their freedom of self-determination all the same. That "self-determination" would always bring them back to Paul Farmer.

But could we blame them individually? Absolutely not! It takes a long time to recondition or decolonize the mind of a nation.

Dr Roger Malebranche

Post by Dr Roger Malebranche » Wed May 07, 2008 5:37 pm

M'ap mande ayisyen frè-m yo ou kesyon. Si nou pa kapab konvenk moun peyi nou ke nou bon, ki moun ki pral konvenk blan yo ke nou bon?
Mwen konnen nou pa renmen resevwa kesyon konsa sepandan se kesyon tout moun nwa dwe mande tèt yo.

Mèsi pou repons la.
Woje.

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Post by jafrikayiti » Wed May 07, 2008 8:59 pm

Hi Guy, Hi Roger,

One important element of this video report to notice is the effort made to recognize that Haitian doctors run the Zanmi Lasante clinic, as Rwandan doctors run the one in Rwanda. Also, in such a short piece, I find refreshing that they featured the African-American doctor's dedication as well.

As for Paul Farmer, i often cite his as a perfect example to illustrate the lingering impact of white supremacist racism on the lives of people today, regardless of their race or personal dispositions. Dr. Farmer is not in anyway responsible for the "white privilege" he enjoys in Haiti - despite his best efforts to distance himself from such impact. Both in his work as a medical doctor and in his social activism, Paul Farmer has proven that he is a no nonsense brother who never fails to throw his best punches in the fight against racism. Whether the beast shows up in international politics (the bicentennial coup, the French government refusing to pay the Charles X ransom stolen from Haiti) or in the scientific community (Worobey's pseudo-science claiming Haitians brought AIDS to the Americas).

Now, when it comes to whether the spotlight enjoyed by Paul Farmer cast shadow on the efforts of Haitian doctors, I must admit that i do not see any evidence of this at all. On the contrary, our brilliant doctors who are now part of the Partners in health team doing miracles all over the world would tend to benefit from Farmer's unselfish leadership.

The greater question that needs to be address concerning how Africans view themselves and their European brothers and sisters, is way bigger than the symptoms we see exhibited in Cange - which Farmer himself has decried.

Also, just as we have good and bad doctors in the U.S. - even some who have graduated from Harvard - we also have a mix in Haiti. For instance, back in 2002, was it not for the generous and valiant intervention of Dr. Blondel Auguste who made it possible for me to enter the General Hospital with my son who was dehydrated with gastroenteritis, I would not have been able to speak on a personal level about the dedication and professionalism of Haitian doctors. Because, in as much as I was impressed by Dr. Auguste, I was sickened by the unprofessional attitude of the doctors i found chatting in the upper floor of the hospital - preparing a strike about this and that - while scores of impoverished women were crying desperately on the main floor with skin an bone babies on their arms, hopeless and without support of any kind. I was equally sickened to see how in Port-de-Paix as in Ile-a-Vache, it was the Cuban doctors who were attending to Haitian patients...while the Haitian ones were still on strike - for God only knows what?

So, yes we have excellent doctors in Haiti who deserve admiration and praise but we also have a serious problem to fix in the way that "class privilege" is taken for granted by many Haitian doctors who do not show any sign of understanding the enormous debt they owe to the nation. Haiti is poor beyond description, yet medical education is subsidize by the State in our country...So, the doctors who steal medical supply from the General Hospital to replenish their private clinics and the myriad of pharmacies of the country are CRIMINALS who deserved to be prosecuted, sued and thrown in jail. If, the good and great Haitian doctors do not get all the respect they deserve, it may also be this sort of "penyen lage" that is still happening in this field that's casting the shadow.

To conclude, in my view, the spotlight on Dr. Farmer should not deter us from honoring our Haitian doctors who are deserving of praise, anymore than honoring and paying due respect to true freedom fighter John Brown who was a "white" American, does, can, or ought to take anything away from our noble forefathers like Jean-Jacques Dessalines (respect be unto him forevermore).

Laverite ka boule je n, men li pap vegle n !

M ale

Jaf

Dr Roger Malebranche

Post by Dr Roger Malebranche » Thu May 08, 2008 12:45 pm

Hi Jaf:

Nothing except love and admiration for Dr Farmer and all those dedicated physicians devoting their lives to care for the poor all over the world. Graduating from Harvard does not make one a good physician. Love and heart do that and those have no color and no money.

Duvalier destroyed the Haitian medical system. Under his dictatorship the only criteria you needed to enroll into the medical school and graduate successfully were to be a macoute or child of one. I sympathize with you when you speak your experience with the system. It will take years, money and efforts to bring it back to its glory, pre Duvalier's days.

Medicine should not be a money piling profession. I believe the WORLD should have a universal medical care for everyone, birth to death. Medicine should be a vocation, a call, not a business. Perhaps it will be like that some day but I doubt it.

I am hoping things will start brightening up at HOME because I would love to spend my last years taking care of my people and imparting the knowledge I have acquired abroad to young devoted Haitians physicians. Try telling that to our politicians, will you ? Young Haitians should be taking care of poor Haitians. Why should Cubans be doing that ? But I should not look at a gift horse in the mouth. As long as the poor of our land is cared for I am grateful.

By the way I don't follow your lead on Jean Jacques Dessalines. As you I will forever be grateful to our great liberators. But I think Dessalines was too bloodthirsty. He could not see past the fight and did not have any idea about what it would take to start a free Haiti on the right foot. Of course he felt he was doing the right thing. But looking at our present day Dr Farmer you must realize that there were probably some Dr Farmers in those days and they were killed because of the color of their skin. Give me Toussaint L'Ouverture any day. For me he will always be the greatest Haitian.

Hope to meet you someday my young Brother.

Roger

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Post by Shelony » Thu May 08, 2008 1:34 pm

Hi everyone,

I join the discussion a little late but I watched the video and I completely agree with Jaf that it is not Dr Farmer's fault that Haitian patients want to be seen by blan. I really admire Dr Farmer for what he has done for the poor of Haiti and, as Jaf mentioned, how he has raised his voice against structural violence. He is my Hero. I wish Haitians doctors (there are a few good ones though) could realize that they owe a lot to the country which provided them with free education. I wish the profession could attract more people with a desire to serve and less people who desire money.

Shelony

Dr Roger Malebranche

Post by Dr Roger Malebranche » Thu May 08, 2008 6:24 pm

We cannot blame Haitian doctors for their free medical education. Lawyers, agronomes and other Haitian professionals get the same free pass. In my days we had to give something back and after completing medical school in 1958 I spent 2 years providing care to the rural "LA COTE", with the government paying me 20 dollars a month. At times the money did not show up and I had to rely on family loans.

There are bad Haitian doctors but there are bad doctors all over the world. I don't think Haitians have cornered that market. And we come full circle back to my first question. Why do Haitians (and not only illiterate ones), why do African Americans, why do Africans (and in substantial numbers, mind you) feel they are better off when getting their medical care from the BLANS? Nothing against Dr Farmer. I would love to meet that MAN one day and thank him for everything he has done for the poor of our land. Another question: Do you believe the Haitian government and Haitian doctors in Haiti would be willing to receive me with open arms and give me accolades if I decided to raise money and open a center some place in Haiti caring for the poor? As they opened the door and their hearts to Dr Farmer. And despite all my medical expertise and knowledge, do you think my Haitian countrymen would form "block long queues" to be seen by MOI, only by MOI? Do you think songs would be written about MOI?

Are we, for some atavistic, deep seated, genetic reasons, attributing magical powers to the BLANS and we do it subconsciously, carefully closing that part of our brains, not wanting to face our demons?

Am I just being a paranoid black Haitian doctor ?

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Post by Guysanto » Fri May 09, 2008 10:53 am

[quote]Are we, for some atavistic, deep seated, genetic reasons, attributing magical powers to the BLANS and we do it subconsciously, carefully closing that part of our brains, not wanting to face our demons?[/quote]
So, Doc, can you try to formulate an answer to your own question?

In an earlier exchange, you wrote:
[quote]Haitians seem to hate Haitians and they go out of their way to destroy each other. Is that a genetic trait? Is it the air we breathe? Am I being paranoid or is it just the human race?[/quote]

I bet you did not like my answer, which follows:
[quote]Dr. Malebranche, when it's not easy to find the true causes of a baffling disease, we fall prey to cheap diagnostics. As a doctor, you know that.

[quote]Is that a genetic trait?[/quote]Roger, I believe you know the answer.

[quote]Is it the air we breathe?[/quote]Again, Roger, I think that deep down you know the answer.

[quote]Am I being paranoid or is it just the human race?[/quote]
Well, there are a lot of things wrong with Haitians' self-perceptions and that's just the beginning of our problems. And it might be the end as well, if we don't have the confidence to recognize that there is nothing inherently wrong with us.

WE HAVE REAL PROBLEMS!! LET'S FACE THEM WITHOUT KNOCKING OURSELVES DOWN.[/quote]

Roger, can you begin to see the pattern?

Most of us love the beautiful French language, but hate the idea of having to write in our own Haitian Creole or to even speak it in sophisticated social situations. Most of us love Christianity, but despise anything remotely connected to Vodou, even "mizik Satan" that is our beautiful roots music with elaborate drumming patterns that are admired by Africans and non-Africans everywhere else in the world. I know a Haitian lady, she is a good friend of mine, who is going to celebrate a very significant anniversary. She too doesn't want any "mizik djab la" in her house and asked me to please look for some nice "chansonnettes françaises" that she can play at her party. Most of us prefer the refined French general Toussaint Louverture who wanted nothing more than an autonomous French colony to the "savage and bloodthirsty" Jean-Jacques Dessalines who actually gave Haitians their independence, who gave land and Haitian nationality to a Polish contingent of Napoleon's army because they too rebelled and embraced the Haitian quest for FREEDOM, who declared all Haitians black regardless of skin color, who declared all freedom-seeking people "Haitian" once they set foot on Haitian soil at the end of their own quest to rid themselves of the shackles of slavery. Most of us look for foreign solutions to all of our problems and reject all serious attempts at self-determination. Most of us do not practice love for each other but prefer to spend interminable hours of conversation [at our parties, at the barber shop, on our radio programs, in practically all of our social gatherings] examining what the hell is wrong with "Haitians" or "Hair siens" (some delight in pointing out).

WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH HAITIANS?

Is it our genes? I don't know, man. I am tired of hearing the question. I suggest that we all start looking for the answer in ourselves rather than in others. In the end, we may find nothing there but just a battered people, lacking in self-confidence, but with all the tools necessary to take on the rest of the world ONE DAY when most of us begin to LOVE, TRULY LOVE OURSELVES.

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Post by Tidodo » Fri May 09, 2008 1:41 pm

Kudos to all of you for some great observations on Dr. Farmer, his colleagues and Haitians in general on these posts. It is a great learning source for those like me who are not in the medical field.

I would not comment on the medical part of the post, as it is not my field. But, as Haitian, I would like to try to partly answer the questions posed by Dr. Malebranche.

[quote]Why do Haitians (and not only illiterate ones), why do African Americans, why do Africans (and in substantial numbers, mind you) feel they are better off when getting their medical care from the BLANS?[/quote]

I would like to start answering this question by another question. Who would you more likely believe will be on time when they make a PROMISE, a Haitian or a White [perhaps any foreigner]?

Unfortunately, some of us don't think that time is important. But, being on time, among other things, creates TRUST that you can keep a promise and suggests that you have self-discipline for people to rely on you. The problem with Haitians regarding trust in their fellow Haitians, I would guess, is not genetic but rather cultural. As a people, self-discipline is not our forte. We pass laws, and we do not respect them. We make appointments and we don't show to them. We routinely make promises that we don't keep. In the USA, they say you are as good as your words. That is not a popular maxim in Haiti! So, why would I trust you with my life when I don't think you can keep the words you gave me?

Haitian children, I might venture in a very fragile way, learned to be generally disciplined during their childhood. They arrived at school on time, in general. In my primary school at the FIC, you would have been expelled after a number of tardinesses in school. Children, in general keep their promises to their teachers, parents, and even neighbours. Although, I don't think we felt obligated to do so to fellow classmates or friends! With the friends, as children, there was no enforcement mechanism of discipline. Again, here I am talking about the place I live in the 60s and 70s. It may be different today in Haiti.

But, when Haitian children become adults, they learn that discipline is not important. As an adult, we don't seem obligated to maintain the discipline we were taught as a child. And the lack of discipline permeates all aspects of our lives. Is it because of years of dictatorship when the only thing that matters was allegiance to the chief to keep your job, go to medical school, be rich, be alive and not dead, etc.?

Believe it or not, the lack of discipline made us unreliable. We all know it of each other. I suspect that distrust of each other had at least something to do with that perception of cultural indiscipline that is very prevalent among adults in Haiti. Funny enough, when we move to places like the USA, where discipline and trust is seen different as an adult, some of us easily remember the discipline we were taught as a child, in order to survive and succeed.

Please don't get me wrong here. I consider the foregoing opinion a hypothesis. Like you I am baffled by this issue and I would like to learn more about it. I would like to hear a better explanation.

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Post by Leoneljb » Fri May 09, 2008 3:04 pm

Well, I believe that is Cultural, not genetic. Although we share similarities to most African Countries in terms of lack of discipline, Dictatorship etc.
But, the 0.001 difference between Blacks and Whites does not affect our behavior. It is traditionally learned from ancesters, I suppose.

Bon pou zafè Doktè-a, mwen pa finn dakò toutafè. Paske, menm jan ak peyi Aziatik yo tèl ke L'End e LaChin, moun pran doktè pou BonDye. Lè ou rive Ayiti, Doktè yo se wa. Mwen sonje anvan Papa'm mouri an 88, mwen te mande Doktè yo de twa keksyon sou ka-a. Mesye yo pat menm te vle pale avè'm.

Pou zafè Blan menm, se oun gwo sijè ki prèske jeneral. Si ou nèg vin a lè, misye se blan. Si oun doktè blan di'w mouri, monchè ou pa menm bezwen di oun mo. Tout sa se oun konplèks denferyorite ke yo mete sou nou depi lontan. Si'w byen gade imaj bondye "le père" se Blan. Jezi se oun blan zye ble. Lè lanj Gabriel ap pyetine Satan ou wè oun blan k'ap sapata oun nèg. Lisifè menm se pa pale. Se la ki montre jan ke yo pa edike nou comme ça devrait.

Sou kòzman Dessalines ak Toussaint, se de moun diferan ki leve diferaman, ki manje, pran baton diferaman. Kidonk, yo wè mond lan diferan.

Toussaint te youn esklav de mezon. Tandis ke Dessalines te ap bourike nan solèy la. Toussaint te panse ke li te ka egal ak blan yo. Men Dessalines, pat panse sa te posib.

Gen moun ki panse ke vizyon Toussaint te ka pi bon pou Ayiti. Men gade sa ki rive'l. Blan yo montre ke Dessalines te gen rezon lè'l te di misye pa kwè ke blan yo bezwen egalite-a vrèman.

Tandiske Dessalines te bezwen libète nèg nwa. Yo ba'l oun vye chay pote paske li pat ekri listwa. Se menm blan franse yo ki te ekri listwa dayiti. Yo di ke li te koupe tèt boule kay. Men yo pat janm di ke anvan, Blan Franse òganize oun fèt pou moun lib yo, men se madanm yo sèlman yo te envite. Sa yo fè, yo tiye depi se mari yo ki te rete lakay. Dessalines menm tande sa, li anvayi blan yo e li tiye oun pakèt blan alawonnbadè. Kidonk li retalye ak mechanste ke Blan yo te fè. Rochambeau, pat lan griyen dan non. Se pa de twa nwa li tiye e tòtire. Ki montre nou awogans blan-an. Li gen dwa masakre. Men depi de twa nan yo mouri, sa se sovajri. N'ap viv "double standard" sa jiska prezan.

Dessalines se te oun bon Leader. Menm jan Malcom se te oun gwo leader. Men, zòt vle montre diferans ant Toussaint ak Dessalines, ant Malcom ak Martin etc. Jodi-a se pwal Reverend Wright ak oun lòt moun. Chak moun aji selon eksperyans yo nan lavi. Se lè oun moun foure zo nan kalalou lè sa n'a wè kote verite-a chita.

Mwen pa vle ale san mwen pa voye oun gwo kout chapo pou Paul Farmer ak tout moun ki ap ede limanite...

L'union fait la Force

Leonel

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Post by jafrikayiti » Sat May 10, 2008 10:32 am

In all this I believe that action speaks louder than words. Especially words of self-flagellation.

It is no mystery how Africans have come to doubt themselves. No people have been attacked in such a violent and consistent manner for the past 600 years. So, now, the question is not how it happened but to ACT to fix the damage done.

Some are engaged in actions of REPARATION....and i, for one, prefer to spend my energy there rather than further propagate the negativity.

As Guy pointed out, your languages, your HISTORY, your culture, your African wisdom (religion), your science....is YOURS to develop and promote...Do it everwhere you can.

At Africammat.com at trinicenter.com at windowsonhaiti.com and many other places on the net you can see what ACTION ortiented folks are doing.

As for those who keep asking between Dessalines and Toussaint who do you like best, mys answer has not changed...it has been on my website for many years now...

"Je zot chèch! l ap mande ou Dessalines ak Toussaint kilès ou pipito?
Men, jounen jodi, pitit libète, kisa ki anpeche ou reponn li: Toulede! ?
Epi, si madichon malfini ta fò ase pou li ret kanpe, kale je w nan je l, mande l, entèwoje l, di l: ou menm "jij", wi oumenm menm, kilès ou pi rayi?"

Dr Roger Malebranche

Post by Dr Roger Malebranche » Sat May 10, 2008 3:56 pm

Regleman pa gate zanmi
Bonjou Frems yo :
Fre Gi :
Si ou-ap fe kritik impasial ou pa kab schwasi de ou twa ti mosso nan let mwen yo pou ou supote pwen de vi pa-ou. Lo ou fe sa ou kraze "kontex" la.
Se memm sistem jounal blan yo te fe ak Obama e reverent Wright. Lo ou fe sa ou mete "spin" pa-w sou let mwen yan e mwen pa gen shans pou-m defend tet mwen. Tout moun sou WOH kap li let yo ap comense di : " mezanmi granmoun nan pa konnin sa lap di. Ala granmoun sot papa. Li komanse gen olzame ". Mwen pa daco ak princip la.
O sije Dessalines e Toussaint, Dessalines te solda li pa-t politisyen. Toussaint te tou de. Messie yo di ke Toussaint te esklav endan kay. Pouki sa Ayisyens ap derespekte neg la. Se pa fot li si li te intelijen, ce pa fot li si blan yo te rekonet ke li te spesial. Gen de nons ki vini nan tet mwen lo map pense Toussaint... Martin ak Mandela. Dessalines fem sonje Mungabe.
Sispenn fe disectyon let mwen yo paske mwen pa la pou-m defend tet mwen. Frem yo ap mete pense nan tet mwen ke mwen ps genyen ak parol ke mwen pa di nan bouch mwen.
Nou pakab dako sou tout bagay men mwen respekte opinyon frem ak sems yo. Mwen espere yo respekte opinyon pam tou.
Bon kouraj AYISYENS. Se FRE nou ye.
Woje.

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Post by Tidodo » Sat May 10, 2008 4:03 pm

[quote]In all this I believe that action speaks louder than words. Especially words of self-flagellation.[/quote]

Jaf, I doubt that you'll find anyone on this forum who disagreed with you on the injustice inflicted in the past on people of African descent that continued today to a lesser extent. Should people of African descent continue to use that injustice as an excuse for not trying to do better every time their endeavors today did not succeed as expected? The answer is a resounding no, and I know you disagree with that, because I have seen your work.

When things do not work as expected or planned, we need to do an introspection and try to find out what went wrong. That is what the most successful people do, including scientists. What did we do wrong? If we do a good job answering that question, our chances of achieving the expected results in the future improve considerably. Perhaps, our problems in Haiti result too often from not having done an honest introspection into our failures as an independent country in the past. Clearly, you cannot condone all the killings, mismanagement, and sheer treason that took place in Haiti since our independence. True, former colonizers and their descendants have tried hard since independence to make it difficult for us to have a successfully economic society. Unfortunately, we have allowed them to succeed by us not learning from our mistakes. We are not perfect! In all honesty, we cannot blame them for all our failures. To recognize that we made mistakes that need to be corrected is having courage. To blame colonization and slavery only for it, 204 years later, is what I would call self-flagellation. "Pain is inevitable, but misery is optional" I don't know who said it first!

It is hard to argue that all the problems facing people of African descent whether in Africa, the Caribbean, in the USA, Canada, and the rest of the world where they live, are caused by history. While we have to live with the vestiges of colonization, we should not let it shackle us down to the avenues of failure. Looking at the interesting group of members we have on this forum, show you that a lot of us, including you, are not using colonization as an excuse not to move forward. We can survive and thrive on it. Our challenge is to show those who are less fortunate than us how to follow our path instead of blaming the legacy of colonization and slavery for their misery.

Let me leave you with an example to ponder on about not learning from one's mistakes, and calling trying to learn from the past, self-flagellation. We all have experienced on this forum losing the draft of a response before posting. It used to happen after pressing a button to review or post it. Although it has not happened to me for a long time now, I make a copy now of everything I wrote before editing, clicking on the PREVIEW or the SUBMIT button. That's about four to five times for each post I make. I always copied the latest version until I see it posted. This is the result of introspection and analyzing what went wrong. If you want to call the process that leads me to waste time making five copies of a post while formulating it self-flagellation, we will agree to disagree. But, the result is that I have not lost the time spent on posting for a long time now. By the way, how many of you make a back-up of what you write before posting it? We can whine repeatedly afterwards how the site ate our posts. But, the whining does not solve the problem of losing it. Only an introspection helps solve it, followed by the hard work of remembering and taking time to make the backup before posting.

Gelin_

Post by Gelin_ » Sat May 10, 2008 8:37 pm

Check out the story and work of Dr. Guy Theodore at http://hospital-pignon.org/NewFiles/DrGuy.html

gelin

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Post by Guysanto » Sun May 11, 2008 4:12 am

[quote]Fre Gi :
Si ou-ap fe kritik impasial ou pa kab schwasi de ou twa ti mosso nan let mwen yo pou ou supote pwen de vi pa-ou. Lo ou fe sa ou kraze "kontex" la.
Se memm sistem jounal blan yo te fe ak Obama e reverent Wright. Lo ou fe sa ou mete "spin" pa-w sou let mwen yan e mwen pa gen shans pou-m defend tet mwen. Tout moun sou WOH kap li let yo ap comense di : " mezanmi granmoun nan pa konnin sa lap di. Ala granmoun sot papa. Li komanse gen olzame ". Mwen pa daco ak princip la.
O sije Dessalines e Toussaint, Dessalines te solda li pa-t politisyen. Toussaint te tou de. Messie yo di ke Toussaint te esklav endan kay. Pouki sa Ayisyens ap derespekte neg la. Se pa fot li si li te intelijen, ce pa fot li si blan yo te rekonet ke li te spesial. Gen de nons ki vini nan tet mwen lo map pense Toussaint... Martin ak Mandela. Dessalines fem sonje Mungabe.
Sispenn fe disectyon let mwen yo paske mwen pa la pou-m defend tet mwen. Frem yo ap mete pense nan tet mwen ke mwen ps genyen ak parol ke mwen pa di nan bouch mwen.
Nou pakab dako sou tout bagay men mwen respekte opinyon frem ak sems yo. Mwen espere yo respekte opinyon pam tou.
Bon kouraj AYISYENS. Se FRE nou ye.
Woje.[/quote]
Woje, ou konsidere mwen tankou ti frè ou. Mwen konsidere ou tankou gran frè mwen. Mwen gen anpil lanmou pou ou, men sa fè mwen mal lò mwen wè ou malentèprete koze yo konsa. Tout sa ou ekri, tout sa mwen ekri, yo la ap kreve je tout moun. Nan pwen gwo rechèch ki bezwen fè pou konnen sa lòt la te di. Amwens ke yon moun pa vle fè efò ditou pou suiv konvèsasyon an. Nan konvèsasyon k'ap fèt la, ou kòmanse ak yon obsèvasyon: Ayisyen byen souvan pito al chache èd nan men blan e pafwa yo menm meprize asistans yon ayisyen parèy yo te kab ofri yo. MWEN DI MWEN DAKÒ AVÈK OU. MWEN OBSÈVE MENM BAGAY AVÈK OU. Kidonk si se yon lòt pwendvi ou panse mwen vle voye monte, souple di m sa li ye.

Sepandan, lò nou fin dakò sou obsèvasyon an, ou kòmanse mande tèt ou ki se ki "wrong" ak ayisyen: èske se konpozisyon jenetik li, èske se lè li respire a, èske se nati li viv ladan-l lan, elatriye. Mwen twouve kalite remak sa yo pa jis. Si se yon blan ki te fè yo, mwen panse ke Dr. Roger Malebranche, se youn nan premye moun ki te pral defann lapatri. Anpil lan nou ta jije ke remak sa yo ofansan, anpil lan nou ta di ke yo rasis, elatriye. Men etandone se youn nan nou ki fè remak la, pa gen pàn. Nou tolere sa. Nou menm gen dwa rantre nan plis refleksyon toujou sou sa ki pa bon avèk Ayisyen. Nou gen dwa retounen sou Listwa pou nou vilifye nèg Desalin-sa ki te ban nou lendepandans. Nou gen dwa di se move chans pèp ayisyen genyen dèske yo pa te twouve yon gran lidè tankou MLK/Mandela/Tousen ki te ba yo endepandans lan pito. [Ann kite espekilasyon istorik sa yo pou yon lòt fwa, paske yo fose anpil e nou merite pale sou yo separeman nan yon lòt konvèsasyon.] Lesansyèl, nou toujou plenyen: pòv ayisyen frè nou, nou renmen frè nou yo anpil, men yo manke kichòy ki fè yo pa moun tankou lòt moun.

Ou esprime santiman sa yo plizyè fwa, Woje. E se sou pwen sa, mwen pa dakò avèk ou. Se pa yon kesyon de voye monte. Se pa yon kesyon de defann yon pwendvi [antouka, m'espere se pa sa.] Se yon dispozisyon pou nou toujou blame tèt nou. Se yon dispozisyon pou nou paralize tèt nou ak negativite. Se yon dispozisyon ki pap janm ede nou fè yon pa ann avan.

[quote]Tout moun sou WOH kap li let yo ap comense di : " mezanmi granmoun nan pa konnin sa lap di. Ala granmoun sot papa. Li komanse gen olzame ". [/quote]
Mwen pa kwè ou bezwen enkyete pou sa. Mwen pa kwè gen yon sèl moun ki patisipe nan WOH ki panse konsa. Pa gen moun ki ta pran Dr. Roger Malebranche tankou yon nèg sòt, apre ou briye nan karyè ou kòm medsen e kòm chirijyen. Si ou te gen olzamè, ou pa ta kab menm kòmanse ekri kreyòl la jan ou fè sa kounyè a, apre anpil retisans. Non, Woje, ou pa konnen-m vre si ou panse ke m'ap chache vilifye ou. Lò yon moun ap chache vilifye yon lòt, se tEt pa-li li vilifye an premye. Mwen gen anpil lanmou pou ou, men mwen panse ou gen twòp negativite nan kè ou, lò w'ap panse a Ayisyen frè ou. Mwen panse tou, ou pa fè yon bòn lekti sou listwa pèp nou. Ou repete anpil bagay "mè" "pè" "sè" (nos voleurs) te aprann nou sou ban lekòl pou yo te aprann nou rayi listwa nou, rayi jan nou te vin endepandan, elatriye. Mwen panse ke nou kab fè wout ansanm pou nou rekonsidere edikasyon nou te resevwa a. Mwen panse nou gen yon bèl avni ansanm nan "Ann Pale" si nou pa rete kwè ke se mechanste youn ap chache fè lòt.

Mwen pap kontinye sou ribrik sa ankò pou kounyè a, paske mwen pral fè yon ti vwayaj pou yon bout tan. M'espere zòt kab kontinye li. Mwen regrèt anpil se konsa ou te pran sa mwen te di yo. Il faut que les choses changent. Yon jou, Ayisyen ap sispann panse se yon pèp modi li ye e kòmanse konprann se yon pèp espesyal li ye, sou baz sa li akonpli deja e tout sa li kapab fè toujou si li rive gen konfyans tèt li.

Tidodo
Posts: 117
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 9:07 am

Post by Tidodo » Sun May 11, 2008 12:42 pm

Guys/Gals,

Dr. Mallebranche was just "thinking loud!" Your reactions confirmed the risk of such a strategy. My guess is that Ann Pale should be able to accommodate all types of thinking, including those we don't agree with. The reason is that somehow we all learn from each other.

When people are thinking loud, they may find it unfair that some of the extreme alternatives they considered are singled out to represent their opinions. I sympathized with his position. While Guy rightly pointed out we mean no malice to him, I would hate to see our reactions discouraging free expression and active participation in discussions on this forum because of differences of opinion.

jafrikayiti
Posts: 218
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2006 7:16 pm

Post by jafrikayiti » Sun May 11, 2008 2:34 pm

Tidodo,

We've been there before and frankly it is unappealing to be going over the same arguments over and over. The fact is, some of us have learned to detach their personal reality (perceived "success" or "failaure") from that of the collectivity to which they genetically belong. You can hear such Haitians or Africans constanly bashing "Haitians", "Africans" - as if it was a group external to the basher who feels absolutely comfortable to always refer to his/her nationality in the third person. That's one mechanism to cope with the post-colonial trauma. Others instead choose a different strategy. Their perception of themselves and of the nation to which they belong (Haitians, Africans), is not dependent on the former enslavers' value system or frame of reference. As such, what others condsider a Haitian or an African who has "made it", does not necessarily fit the frame. So all this talk about "work hard" is actually insulting. What people have worked HARDER than Africans over the past 600 years?

The prize for a conscious African is not to have a salary, a house and a bank account....no matter how huge. So it is not a matter of - not letting history block ONE from attaining what "others" consider suceess. Much more valuable than individual accumulation of weath, there is a collective welbeing that conscious Africans on this planet are strugling for. And, no they do not let "history" stop them. On the contrary, good overstanding of Ourstory is essential to attain our prize and every decade strides have been made on the road to success. Just as Dessalines built on the imperfect efforts of Toussaint, who himself built on those of Boukman who followed Makandal, who followed Plimout etc... , the works of Marcus Garvey, Fanon, Price Mars, Firmin, Cheick Anta Diop, Jacques Stephen Alexis,King, Malcom, Biko, Winnie and Nelson Mandela are being carried forward by Molefi Kete Asante, Omali Yeshitela, Wole Soyinka, Jean Phillipe Omuntunde, Marguerite Laurent, John Maxwell etc... All these Africans could have been satisfied that their "hard work" had earned them "success". They could stop facing reality but their prize has not yet been reached...so it is only normal if so many of us feel that we must keep WORKING harder than those who have already "made it"...

So, to get back to the topic at hand, I don't see the point in lamenting that huge populations of Africans continue to exhibit symptoms of mental damage (worship of everything European, from Leonardo da vinci's portrait whom they were taught is "god" to trusting awhite doctor over an African one). We know why these symptoms are still perceptible...we know what disease they represent and we also have in our hands the tools to treat the disease. So, some of us have decided to get to work and stop whining about the symptoms.

This is exactly why the books , CDs, DVDs, motion pictures debunking the racist propaganda that has zombified such large portions of our populations must be available in our langauages. From Wolof to Kreyol, from Kiswahili to Eve etc...

Many of us are so conscious of the road left to travel, that we feel restless and unwilling to waste too much time rehashing the obvious with folks who know the facts but simply feel to bound to the status quo to even question its inevitability.

Pawol pale se van, pawol ekri se dokiman. Aksyon kosekan sèlman ki pote bon chanjman.

Jaf

Dr Roger Malebranche

Post by Dr Roger Malebranche » Sun May 11, 2008 6:38 pm

Hi Tidodo :

Thanks for the nice entry and your attempt at defending my rights to express my points of view. You are correct. I was thinking loud. I felt I was in the midst of brothers and sisters and, as in any Haitian house, sunday noon, with animated discussions going around the dinner table I was letting my hair down ( whatever I have left of it ) and I was thinking loud. I realize that I was wrong.
I understand better now why we are at the bottom of the pile after all those years. A few seem to have been annointed to lead the bulk of us and dissent is not tolerated. They have the answer. Duvalier also had the answers and did not tolerate dissent.
I think and look at things in a surgical way. I see what has to be done and I get to the pathogenesis of the disease. I see what's important to the welfare of the patient and what is just window dressing. I have frailties and I do my own introspection. I was trying to encourage fellow Haitians to look into their souls and face the demons that have held us back for so many years. I always did my own thinking.
It is obvious that I have stumbled upon the wrong group. I tried to fit in but it is obvious that there is a " party " line and I was not following it.
Thanks again.
Roger.

Tidodo
Posts: 117
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 9:07 am

Post by Tidodo » Sun May 11, 2008 8:19 pm

[quote]We've been there before and frankly it is unappealing to be going over the same arguments over and over. [/quote]

Jaf,

Sorry, but you are the one who keeps bringing it up [calling self-flagellation every time someone who wants to progress looks into errors made in the past] forgetting that many do not necessarily agree with you on the process you believe is the right one to follow. The reality is that your argument is not very convincing!

As a historian, Jaf, "chapo ba" to you! You have some valid points as to the causes of our ancestors' victimization. But, we are not victims anymore, in the sense that our present and future are not 100% dependent on others' decisions. That's the major weakness of your argument. Some parts of our past after independence were dependent on our own decisions. We, independent of foreign influence, have made some bad decisions, as a nation. We should take responsibility for them and not blaming others. In so doing, it is not self-flagellation, it is a sign of maturity.

While you and others mentioned in your previous posts have decided to follow a certain path, it is just your choices. That path has not been proven yet to be the best way to prosperity for Haiti. When others ask questions that may challenge that path, it should be an opportunity to reaffirm its strength and to perfect it. When you try to impose it instead, you are exposing the weaknesses of the argument for that path.

[quote]On the contrary, good overstanding of Ourstory is essential to attain our prize and every decade strides have been made on the road to success.[/quote]

Perhaps, I don't understand this sentence. I can't seem to see the "strides ..on the road to success." All foreign press reports mentioning Haiti refer to us as "the poorest country in the western hemisphere." Press pictures are showing our people mixing dirt to supplement daily meals. So, what strides and what road to success are we talking about here? We are being called a "failed state." I don't remember other black Caribbean nations like us being called or seen that way.

Don't get me wrong, Jaf. I admire and respect you. Let's agree to disagree within the confines of mutual respect.

Leoneljb
Posts: 222
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2006 10:29 pm

Post by Leoneljb » Sun May 11, 2008 9:01 pm

Great piece Guys,

But, like Tidodo, I used to think that was a "Self-destructive Haitian Problem". We (HAitians) couldn't do anything good. But, unlike Tidodo, I understand that we have more able People than what we're witnessing under the Political radar. Unfortunately, they are living outside in some Western Countries: The Doctors, Engineers, Scientists and all. There is a cause for this exportation of Brain. And, Duvalier is not the only catalyst for this Exodus.

Another thing I realized some years ago. Most of the trouble Countries had their natural Ressources stolen by some Western Countries; the so-called "Rich". You know what I'm talking about. It's easy to say "Let's forget about the Past". But, very difficult when all your natural posessions and Manpower had been stolen from you.

Se pa oun ti moso piyay non ke zOt t'ap fE. PreSke tout peyi ki te patisipe nan kolonizasyon yo ap byen mennen. E yo toujou vle pou peyi yo kolonize yo, bliye pase...

We can argue all we want. But, it won't be easy to accept the fact that once exploited, one can not overcome the period of depression following years of wrong-doing.

Mwen kOmanse gen dOmi. Men, si nou te kOmanse oun politik de retou kote tout Ayisyen ta tounen lakay including "Me". LE sa, petEt, bagay yo ta pi byen.

Se pa de en sEvo non nou genyen k'ap ede lOt peyi. Wi, gen kEk vakabon lakay. Menm jan lan tout peyi. Men, fO nou wE kiyEs ki sitire tout diktatE zenglendo yo?

Epi, pa konprann ke yo ede peyi yo vrEman. Paske se ou politik de depandans ke zOt anploiye. Kote ou oblije depann de yo tout tan.

Sa se opinyon pam, sa pa vle di se li ki pi bon...

L'union fait la Force,

Leonel

Serge
Posts: 326
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 10:39 am

Post by Serge » Sun May 11, 2008 11:43 pm

Friends,

Just a quick shout to say that I have not abandonned the Forum, but I am just in an extremely busy period and I bearly have time to go to WOH.

At this late hour, I quickly read theses exchanges. Fascinating and fruitful exchange. I do not have the time to go into much, but I find it unfortunate that Roger is suggesting that he is somehow shut out of the debate and not being allowed to express his views. If anything, his reactions illustrates precisely one problem in our society: the lack of tolerance for divergent positions. We need to learn how to agree to disagree. We need to know when our positions may not be accurate, when what we tought was accurate, was based on false premisses, or when it is time to re-evaluate our positions. In other words, to keep a cool head when discussing.

I know I am not adressing the issue here, but I just wanted to touch base . I have no even read the exchanges about the American primaries.

Sa grav nèt! Mwen nan bagay sa pou kèk semen ankò.

Kenbe fèm tout moun!

Serge

P.S. Felisitasyon pou Woje kap voye monte nan kreyòl la kare bare! Dòk, ou wè sa pat pi mal pase sa.

Tidodo
Posts: 117
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 9:07 am

Post by Tidodo » Mon May 12, 2008 8:21 am

[quote]...The prize for a conscious African is not to have a salary, a house and a bank account....no matter how huge. So it is not a matter of - not letting history block ONE from attaining what "others" consider suceess. Much more valuable than individual accumulation of weath, there is a collective welbeing that conscious Africans on this planet are strugling for.[/quote]

Jaf,

Sorry man, speak for yourself! The people who are forced to mix dirt to have a meal will not agree with you that a descent salary, a house and a bank account are not the prizes for them. Collective wellbeing does not fill empty bellies, if not to mention just one of the many life essentials those conscious Africans don't have access to.

Tidodo
Posts: 117
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 9:07 am

Post by Tidodo » Mon May 12, 2008 9:20 am

[quote]But, like Tidodo, I used to think that was a "Self-destructive Haitian Problem". We (HAitians) couldn't do anything good. [/quote]

Leonel,

My man, it is always a pleasure to have an exchange with you. When will we eat another "mayimoulen ak pwason" together in Florida? Anyway, Leonel, I don't believe that Haitians "could not do anything good." Perhaps, my fumbling of the English language may have given that impression. Just to give you an example of Haitian accomplishments that I am very proud of, I always told foreigners that Kreyòl is one of the most modern languages!

We have made mistakes in the past. All countries do. But, we don't have the discipline to go through the process of analyzing our mistakes and take the right steps to prevent their recurrence. When we attempted the process of correcting mistakes, like when we rewrote the constitution, we ended up with politically self-serving rules like the prohibition on double nationality. That meant we were not interested in accepting the facts that we did not like. Proper analysis requires that you accept all facts, including those we don't like. So, Leonel, if there is a self-destructive Haitian problem, it is our lack of discipline in conducting our affairs as adults. But, don't get me wrong, that is not the only personal problem we have to deal with. But, I am gradually believing that the lack of self-discipline is an overriding one.

[quote]...But, unlike Tidodo, I understand that we have more able People than what we're witnessing under the Political radar. Unfortunately, they are living outside in some Western Countries: The Doctors, Engineers, Scientists and all. [/quote]

Leonel,

I strongly believe in the capacity of the Haitian People. Those who accept the sacrifice of self-discipline, once they leave Haiti they prosper in whatever field they chose or fell comfortable with. The day that you have justice - property and civil rights - and security in Haiti, they will be able to return, and put all that to benefit the country and themselves, and those still in the country will be motivated to develop their country. As you well know many Diaspora members tried to return with their savings accounts after Jean-Claude Duvalier left. They are all back in their respective adopted foreign countries without the savings accounts, because there was no justice and security not only to protect them, but also to allow them to reach their objectives of giving back to Haiti.

[quote]It's easy to say "Let's forget about the Past".[/quote]

Leo, I can't remeber saying "let's forget about the past." I adopted a motto often used here in the USA: "I can forgive, but I can't forget." Thus, it would be unlikely for me to say "let's forget about the past." What I think I tried to say was to learn the lessons of the past, but let's take advantage of the opportunities of the present and future. In other words, I hate what the French did to our ancestors. But, if doing business with them today will make Haitians prosper and feed our people, let's do business with them. I used the French as an example, but it applies to all the other nations who had exploited our people and natural resources in the past, including the USA.

Dr Roger Malebranche

Post by Dr Roger Malebranche » Mon May 12, 2008 1:38 pm

My Kreyol is not good enough yet to attempt what I am going to say but I am working diligently on it. This entry will be in English, unfortunately. First I think Serge for his words of encouragement and I will try to not let him down. I also thank Gelin for his inset on one of our compatriotes doing good work in Haiti, Dr Guy Theodore. I noticed in the CV that he became a fellow of the American college of surgeons in 1982 and words were added that he was one of the few Haitians surgeons to reach that point. NOT TRUE. There are quite a number of Haitian surgeons who are Fellows of the College, FACS. I became a fellow in 1975 and I am a lifetime member of that group. I thank Tidodo again and Leonel.
As a Haitian I never lost confidence in my abilities and in the abilities of the Haitian race in general. If Guy and Jaf felt that was what I implied in my entries I apologize. That was not my point.
From the days I arrived in the USA in 1961 I was accused of being cocky, having an attitude and being an uppity N. You were not born yet Jaf. My answer to that was always: " Whatever you can do I can do better. And if you don't believe me I will prove it to you".
I am the product of a proud Haitian upbringing, and in my youth any Haitian would be mortified if confused him with a Jamaican, a Porto Rican, a Cuban, an African... you name it. We were that proud and that unique. That pride and uniqueness have been taken away from us unfortunately.
I went to Saint Louis de Gonzague and I remember my mother being extremely upset at me for bringing a "carnet" of second in a class of 30, for letting a young Haitian of Syrian descent get the First and placing ahead of me. I will forever remember her words : " Ou pa gin wont. Ki gen ou kap kite ou blan sot pase devan ou. Kote fiete ou. Se neg noi ou ye. Ou pa pitit mwen. Ou fem wont " ! Those were the days. I look at all Haitians as I look at myself and perhaps I should not. We have unlimited potential but we don't use it unless we go to other lands where we are challenged and have to compete to succeed and make a living. WE THEN REDISCOVER OUR DISCIPLINE AND OUR PRIDE.
My questions were and still are : How can Haitians sit in the Senate and have a free for all on Boulos having an American passport, finally expulsing him, when kidnappings, claims of Haiti having given AIDS to the world, hunger, overpopulation, sickness, occupation by foreign forces, killings of many superb Haitians who had chosen not to leave the country etc... are daily events ? What are they thinking ? Are they thinking ?
How can those politicos hide behind a constitution ( a legacy from the blans ) treat it like it was handed to them from a burning bush and refuse double nationality to people who could help the country by setting it on the right course and infusing needed cash into our moribond Haitian economy ? And then they have their hands out for the Diaspora to fill.
Haiti has laws WHEN those laws favor what the politicians try to do or try not to do at the time. Otherwise the laws are moot. I should know. My family lost everything it had at Laboule, Anse a Veau, Port au Prince etc... Suddenly our laws stopped to work. I never tried for restitution. I figured my hungry countrymen needed those lands more that I did.
I refuse to demand reparations from countries that harmed us centuries ago. It feels to me like begging and that goes against my Haitian pride. I refuse to blame everyone else for our problems. We have created our own problems. We should stop playing the victims. We are adults in charge and the Lord has given us the tools to compete with. We should get of our asses ( excuse me for that word ), stop bitching about THIS grievance, THAT grievance and show people that we can do what our ancestors did 200 plus years ago... shake the world to its fundations. Yes we can succeed if we stop bickering, complaining about people having picked on us or picking on us, if we try to get to the real needs of our people and not the superficial window dressing ones and work together on a bright Haitian future. Haiti has serious problems and needs serious solutions. UNFORTUNALY we keep delivering the country into the hands of INSERIOUS people.

Leoneljb
Posts: 222
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2006 10:29 pm

Post by Leoneljb » Mon May 12, 2008 1:47 pm

Tidodo, mwen dakO avE'w sou pwen sa.

The past sometimes can keep us down, indeed. Of Course, we can deal with France or USA regardless. But, in a mutual interest that all can benefit from...

I also believe that we had a lot of Leaders who couldn't deliver. But, jou va jou vien, n'a va rive!

By the way, Tidodo, moun mayi yo pote'm plent pou ou. Ou fini ak tout mayi yo!!!

Usually, m toujou te konn dakO avE'w. Men petEt, mwen te li'w mal. Si se sa, mwen sorry.

Gen oun pakEt moun ki benefisye de jan Ayiti ap mache'a. Konsa gen oun pakEt peyi tou ki benefisye lE nou pa gen oun Fonctioning gouvernman tankou sa'n pase yo. LE konsa yo anvayi mache nou an ak salopri. Anpil manb ONG ap fE lajan elatriye. Kidonk, byen ke oun pakEt Ayisyen konplis. Men sepandan, dan le monn, depi oun lidE pwogresis. Peyi enperyalis yo mete'l atE. Something is very fishy here.

Mwen pa konn si'm deraye de sijE'a. Men, pwoblEm nou an Ayiti gen anpil sous. E se pa Ayisyen sElman ki la koz.

Men anpil chay pa lou,

Leonel

Tidodo
Posts: 117
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 9:07 am

Post by Tidodo » Mon May 12, 2008 2:26 pm

[quote]..Mwen pa konn si'm deraye de sijE'a. Men, pwoblEm nou an Ayiti gen anpil sous. E se pa Ayisyen sElman ki la koz.[/quote]

Leo,

I totally agree with you that our problems are very complex. But, the solutions start with us putting order in our own backyard, first. Otherwise, every time you start the second phase of requesting fair treatment, they point to you as causing your own problems and you can't prove them wrong.

[quote]Gen oun pakEt moun ki benefisye de jan Ayiti ap mache'a. Konsa gen oun pakEt peyi tou ki benefisye lE nou pa gen oun Fonctioning gouvernman tankou sa'n pase yo. LE konsa yo anvayi mache nou an ak salopri.[/quote]

You are right. But, we are now living in a global environment. Our fruits growers in LaPlaine or Cap Haitien and our casava makers in Gros Morne are competing with the Dominican manufacturers who are selling those products to Publix here in Miami that I buy regularly. In other words, Leonel, we have to make our products competitive worldwide. Otherwise, other countries, and not necessarily the most developed ones, will saturate our market with theirs. That has nothing to do with politics, but pure market dynamics. It is our responsibility to ensure that our products are competitive worldwide. But, right now, we are too busy "politicking" among ourselves. Meanwhile, the rest of the Caribbean countries are eating our lunch.

Leoneljb
Posts: 222
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2006 10:29 pm

Post by Leoneljb » Tue May 13, 2008 6:37 am

Tidodo, I understand the Global Competition involved. But, what I wanted to say, our Market is flooded illegaly by Rice from wherever, where the one from l'artibonite is considered almost obsolete because of the difference in prices.

Why wouldn't the Haitian government put a tarif on Foreign Products? Well, we all know that Haiti is not really Independent in that aspect. Decisions are made in DC, Paris and elsewhere. This is the complexity of our situation!

Si sitiyasyon yo chanje, nou pap bezwen MInustah, tout pakEt ONG sa yo, an plis nou pap bezwen pakEt sekirite sa yo. Ou konprann nan ki avantaj moun li ye pou Ayiti rete konsa?

Se menm jan, nan Afrik di sid, Jamayik elatriye. Li pi bon, pou oun pakEt moun ki renmen dekalaj sa yo.

I accept that we are the ones to make it better. But, I won't be so naive to think that our problems are self-inflicted.

Please don't take my word (naive) personally. I wanted to take another one. But, believe me I couldn't find a better one this morning.

I know that we all are getting older. We would like to see Change Now. But, we can get bettre, or we will get better eventually. I also would like to see more Diaspora involved instead of being like outsiders. Personally Im sick of receiving the so-called Help from the US of A Govt. We need to seek Help elsewhere. Where we can choose and keep our own Leaders for the benefits of our People.

Sorry Paul Farmers, I know that this thread was supposed to be a tribute to your good work. But, you know us Haitians, We go to Parties to discuss Politics. Nou pap kite, fO nou fE ti Politik nou. Se sa ki kenbe nou vivan toujou...

Leonel

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